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How are professional poster color paints made?ApproveRejectUn-ApproveSubscribeUn-Unsubscribe

Question asked 2020-06-26 20:02:27 ... Most recent comment 2020-07-03 15:54:47
Paint Making Gouache

I read: https://pigment.tokyo/article/detail?id=28 

And contacted a few manufacturers, but they gave me very little info, other than that they have "extender pigment" and other additives. So not just gum arabic with pigment. 

I'm wondering if there is a poster color medium out there that I can just add a pigment dispersion to?  

I was recommended to come here from reddit, so first post! 

-Jeremy

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Moderator Answer (brian baade)

[2020-06-26 22:10:00]

Welcome

One of the first things you will realize here is that some of us…especially me, are sticklers for terminology. So, to start out, there is really no specific paint binder required to call a paint “poster color”. This could run the gamut from gum Arabic, to dextrin, to acrylic dispersions, to poly vinyl acetate, to practically anything. In the US the term was generally used to describe paints not intended for permanent uses, very often paints to be used for temporary posters announcing grocery store sales.

I watched the video and realize that this is not what the company is trying to convey. I believe that they are referring to a fluid, opaque gouache-like paint. There have been high quality gouache paint intended for illustration and the creation of advertising images. The paints were useful since they dried very matte and could be photographed without reflected hot spots. Casein paints were also used for the same purpose in the mid-20th century. As far as a gouache without additional fillers, most gouache paints had some sort of opacifier. They were essentially opaque watercolors which could be applied with some thickness without cracking. Most, if not all would contain a binder (gum Arabic or dextrin, later any number of binders) an opacifying material (often chalk), preservatives, humectants, and perhaps other additives. These were basically necessary to create a paint that would be opaque, not crack, and not putrefy in the tube or jar.

The paints in the video are in jars suggesting that they were quite fluid. This would also mean that they would need to be well thinned with water to prevent reticulation and delamination. Additionally, they probably also had some sort of stabilizer to prevent the pigment from settling out of the thinned mixture.

Additionally, I would like to state that animation cels using such water based binders have not always fared very well in the long term. Gums and starches are not especially good adhesives to keep pigments bound to sheets of acetate. I have seen numerous examples of whole sections of the paint delaminating from the support.

Finally, if you are intending to make your own colors to do traditional drawn animation, I would not suggest using simple pigments in Arabic. I would not even suggest a gum based binder. Likely, a proprietary paint made for the purpose with an acrylic or PVA binder would be far superior.

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User Comment

[2020-06-27 13:13:44]

Thanks for the response Brian, this is highly informative.

Yes, I was thinking mostly the "professional poster" colors from Japan, like this Nicker brand and Shinhan used for their animation purposes. 

I've tried the Shinhan and it does seem pretty gouachey, I've compared it to Flashe, which is a polyvinyl.  

Shinhan does offer a medium, but I'm not sure if it is just gum-arabic, im assuming it is.  

An opacifier...that makes sense, do colored gessos fit into the same category in this instance then? Calcium carbonate based mostly? 

What im after is essentially a very opaque, very fast drying and very matte paint that I can layer, I wouldn't be using any water.  I don't actually want any colors to blend at all, and if I could get a white over a black without seeing the black, that would be ideal. 

This medium seems to describe what I want: http://www.janmcdonald.com/artrisings/?p=269  

"Kremer’s translucent wax medium either used as a medium or as a binder for dry pigments dries pretty fast like egg tempera.  Strokes dry almost instantly and can’t be effectively blended.  I use short linear overlapping strokes to simulate values or hues (like one would with pastels) and the strokes stay where they are, so in that way it also handles like egg tempera."

Flashe gets close to achieving this, but their colors are not as opaque as the Shinhan poster paint. 

The reasoning behind trying to figure out how the poster colors are made is that they only come in tiny jars of 40ml.....I would be satisfied if they came in larger jars or if there were a medium I could add my own pigment dispersion into I suppose.  

Not sure what im after...I was going to try the Nicker poster color since they have so many colors to work with, maybe there are other "professional" poster colors in Japan....I've only found Shinhan, Nicker, Sakura, Turner.  And from what I've read the Turner and Sakura are not as good quality compared to the other two.  

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Moderator Answer (mkinsey)

[2020-06-30 21:01:15]

​Just a couple of thoughts: The desired properties described sound a lot like theatrical casein scenic paint. I mentioned this in correspondence with Brian, and he advised caution about the pigments used in scenic paints, which may not be permanent to the standards of artistic painting. With paints in that category, and for poster colors as well, it can be difficult to obtain information about pigment content. (The retired Utrecht Primary Artist Tempera Colors had a starch-based binder, in case anyone was curious.)

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User Comment

[2020-07-03 15:54:47]

​Hi Matt, where can one find casein scenic paint? Like the Rosco scenic paint?  

I contacted Shinhan and they do actually offer a "poster color medium" which is gum arabic mixed with other things, they did not tell me what is in it.  Unfortunately they don't sell it currently, but it might be back in stock eventually.  Only 40ml.  

As for Nicker poster colors, Nicker offers 130ml (down from 140ml) from a shop called Sekaido in Toyko.  

Unfortunately they do not ship overseas, however proxy shipping through other companies is available, though pricey unfortunately.  

Some sort of modern tempera would be interesting to try, I remember there being a russian(?) brand...but I've forgotten the name.  

The wall and wax mediums from Kremer pigments sound pretty cool..I may have to give them a go too.  


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